Carbs and GLUCOMETERS-CHEAP

[Roger Rittenhouse-vmaxept <roger@vmaxept.com>]

Hey Ridecamper.. and all you carbo flames.. well not to toss more hay on
the fire-- and not do more 'metoo' stuff.. but it sure is great to hear
from those who stepped out of the grain locker and started trying this
protocol.. 
a little musing here so bear with me--
seems to me one reason many of these horses could be having problems is
- we - including me - just jumped on this FAT feed program..
 well i am not so sure it was the best program -- like too much maybe
--and all this high fat diet could or just maybe- is messing with the
carbo - starch - process of the grains to glucose to glycogen.. like the
horse gets all the fuel from fat and the systems then don't process the
carbs correctly-- just a thought -or my thought - unfounded i know...

seems MY guys are in fact getting a bit punky after 30 miles like a let
down - now we go slow- if i remember years ago  when i did not know much
more then i know now- i feed the good old high molasses sweet feed from
my local feed guy and maybe added a few oz of corn oil - but they went
ok.. carol and i were talking about it since all this is back on line
again..
seems the high fat has had other effects then keeping weight on- but
then that is a good part of the  higher fat diet- they do keep the
weight-   but the 9 to 10 % may be too much..

anyway as i have said many times over the past 3 years.. the carbo
supplementation does work.. you have to find out how to do it - no
different is finding out how much electrolytes to use and grain to feed
and what ever.. i think and have always thought grain feed during a race
was asking for trouble. especially corn - which never really digests in
the upper gi - hard grains, will end up in the colon - fiber only
processing right- and then it ferments.. colic  
i really liked the lectures and papers by DR Kathy CRANDELL KER (aerc
od100 phd a thru z)

while we don't agree on the carbo supplementation she is looking at it..

I will hazard a guess, why i have such good luck with this protocol - 
IF my idea that the high fat has caused a problem with natural carb
processing, then  the addition of freely available slow up-take glycogen
sources - satisfies the needs at  the time.. 
sort of like the alfalfa feeding thing -- binds up the Ca.. then they
don't know how to release Ca internally when they need it..so we give
then more CA during a race to provide un-bound Ca.. and kill the
thumps..

Well could the added carbs do that also - 

i found the pre loading is NOT NOT  correct for my horses.
more is not better - i found 1 to 2 oz per 10 miles or 1.5 hrs is what i
need  for the test horse. 
i mix it up with probi and the electrolytes and carry it in one of those
small squeeze bottles runners and campers use- like a toothpaste tube..
Aust Conn has them
I carry a syringe.. it takes about 30 sec to give it-- i normally pick a
spot where we are walking up a hill or at a water stop.. 

i mix the stuff up in the am before the start and at the longer holds.

no rant here - i choose to use this as a substitute for high grain
rations.. no horse has been killed as some suggested.. 

those that had so called problems- the ones i checked into-- let their
horse move out faster and used them up - as in over did it, went too
fast for the current condition. horse had lots of go power so why not
use it up.. also a few pre loaded and a few gave 4 oz or more per stop.
nothing like a good grain overload to trash a horse-- sostuff

without a glucometer there is no way you can tell where you horse's
glucose level is -- 
norms are 90mcg/dl to 100
too low --i suggest under 80

when fame was less then 80 she really slowed down.

test rides
I have not given her any at the start-still dont- I take a reading in
the am look for normal
Then vc 1 it is usually about 120 to 130- liver dumping.. that's good  
most vc 1 are about 12 to 15 out, that also indicates they are going ok
a low reading here would indicate the horse is going to bonk in the next
loop.. and i bet looks poor now .
I saw the major drop occur at about 25 to 30 miles  reading like 85 to
as low as 78 were taken.
I had a 75 at the 45 mile point and 70 to as low as 65 at the finish- 
on my test runs.. and she looked like crap and took hours to   start to
improve and want to eat.

NOW IF i find out what it takes to keep her at 90 +/- 5 then she never
runs low of blood glucose and the brain and cns keeps on working and the
muscles can use the glycogen from the blood rather then the stored
glycogen. slow burn the fat and feed the muscles with new sources of
glycogen. and keep the fat burning  --but glycogen becomes my primary
fuel source --oh  guess not- but i think they switch that way no matter
what the books say. but then i only ride em.

i have feed alot of hay at rides - don't see this doing much but fill
the gut.. i prefer beet pulp - now that gets the fluid levels up, but
how long does it take to get fuel-ffa vfa- from this hay - 12 hrs or
more - wont do her any good today.. 

the carbo - i use- ViTA FLEX CARBO CHARGE is NOT simple sugar..
its not like loading up with corn syrup - we did that trick way back in
the 70/80s that did not work.. this stuff is a complex sugar. the info
sheet- carbohydrate fuel as glucose polymers ....
and the chromium is to keep the insulin from swinging high to low..
that's how i see it anyway.
this stuff comes up slow in about 1/2 hr but peaks in 3 to 4, HOWEVER if
the horse is burning the fuel it wont peak - and the blood levels stay
sort of flat.
i was able to keep fame at about 85 to 110 for a whole 50 miles and she
looked great and ate and was full of her type-a self - all day  -- fun
to ride and not over ride, and healthy at the end. she never got tired..
willing to go on.. never ran low of fuel for the brain -cns- muscles.

do i really understand all the chemistry and physiology that really goes
on. heck no - i have listened 3 or more  times to Dr X lectures and read
what I can.. and they all say this wont work.. but it does.
SO rather then be shut down by those who have NOT tested the effects or
don't want to because - it is not normal.. like going 100 miles is..

then try it your self in a controlled test program at home. 
I ran tests on training rides to see what 1 oz would do then 2 etc.. i
tried pre- loading at home - that was a fun ride- hit her with 3 oz in
the am by mid day went out for work ha- wild - blood glucose was about
125 at the start- like a kid wired on candy  - her hr - well a bit high
and would not settle.. may explain why those that could not get the
pulse down after giving too much - had problems.

AS a business person who looks for great deals - i found 31 new
glucometer - for next to zip- why-- the fda mandated dates for the test
strip has expired - big whoop-- still will work - the units are still
made -test strips are from $15 to $30 a box..

I have 2 models  mfgr is MEDISENSE
Model Exactech RSG    new $35  sell $15  qty 10
Model Precision QID   new $70	sell $25 qty 21
plus shipping $3.50

looking for more - hope to find some

See my web page I put pictures of the box - front and back out there
www.vmaxept.com

cant get a better deal- If I have any left will bring then to
convention.

so there you go- want to try something on the edge - just to see what
your horses resting and working levels are at home and at a race-- would
be a real eye opener.. then you can decide if you want to supplement at
a race.  


so there you are- please no flames private or personal -but then i took
all that the last time.. i am very surprised the group that puts this
down the most have not ran any tests in the field at a ride.

a few other post notes to comment on - yes i have used this on a multi
day natrc ctr-- after the first day i gave my old mare 1 oz then later
that night another - her glucose levels after the 35 mile day one at
about 6mph were 80 or so- notes all over the place here-- she perked up
in the evening ate etc. - then in the am she was 95.. had a very nice
ride.. no i did NOT give her any during the actual ride just after the
first day and at the end- sure did keep her pumped up -- lost some
horsemanship points - but we loose so many anyway what's the difference.
I did it as a test to see the effect on another horse. She does not need
it - but then she never slowed down. I think this year I will check the
levels - if low give her an oz then check again- but if she is eating
etc.. an oz or 2 after day one and after the ride will be ok. why let
her get  depleted  of reserves.

this is long enough
more later as i read all the posts
roger and
carbo rat 1 and 2


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