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RE: [RC] [RC] [RC] A few points - heidiI don't think so. A 50 just isn't very hard. A 100 is very hard. Your argument was based on difference in difficulty, and a 50 isn't really very much harder than an LD. Many riders would disagree with you. I found that the 50s came easily as well--but then I started with the 100s and worked down. But I think I'm in the minority. It's not consistent to say that 2 25's don't add up the same as 1 50 when 2 50's add up the same as a 100. While the career mileage accrues the same, the points sure don't. It’s the fact that the categories aren’t treated equally when there isn’t a good reason to do so. I’m in the category that I’d like to be in, and still feel like it doesn’t make sense. This isn’t at all about recognition in my mind. Several good reasons have been listed. No point in repeating them. Heidi, I’m IN the next category. I know--my comment was rhetorical. I think many people care quite a lot. We've had numerous, ongoing arguments, often quite passionate, about this for years here. While I see "passionate" arguments on internet forums, I just don't see it out on the trail. The main beefs I've heard from riders in person, who are out there riding the rides, have been the problem with accurate reporting of times on LDs (which the AERC Board has already addressed and corrected) and the BC issue. Still working on that one... Again, that’s a diversion. Go off on the dumbing down stuff, and completely miss the point of whether it’s right or fair to have a national LD BC award and having some RM’s just decide on their own not to do that. I agree that is wrong--but that isn't what we were talking about. We were talking about recognizing the distances in the same way. As you state, we already dealt with the placings issue, which was also largely a regional problem. But those two things still don't make the rides "endurance" rides--they are still run differently and have some unique rules that are necessary for the horse's safety at the shorter distances. That’s the semantic part of the argument, and while I don’t agree, I think it’s the least important part of the discussion. It’s fine for them to have unique rules _if it makes sense and is fair_. The "making sense" part is the horse safety part. And striving to keep horses safe is the most "fair" thing of all to do, since our horses don't give a damn about the rest of it anyway. I think pulsing down was what really solved it. Having a standard pulse into hold of 60-64 bpm is probably one of the best things ever for the horses in this sport. I don’t think points changed anything. David, ALL of the changes helped to make the difference. Not just any one thing--ALL of them. It is foolish to single out one change and hold it up as being the be-all and the end-all that solved the problem. Again, I don’t think points is nearly as big a deal as the controls. If you don’t pass the controls, 0 points for you, one way or the other. We give PNER points for LD, and there’s a bunch of highly competitive people, and I’ve seen teams place 3 50+ mile horses in the LD knowing they’d take a bunch of top-10 places. We’ve still got the points, but the controls prevent the abuses. I have yet to see the competitive PNER riders out racing the LD rides for top points. You are talking about team points here--whole nuther category of competition. And I have yet to see the teams racing in the same manner that used to be the norm on the shorter rides for the win points. It just flat does not compare. The people who are capable of turning up the heat are out there running 50’s in 4 hours. Even giving LD points, the people on top of the heap are running the long distances. Winning an LD gets you as many points as being around 7th in a 50. And I just don't see them doing it. They still go out and do the 50s, because they want AERC mileage, too. So by not having AERC mileage on the LDs, the points chasers are still moving up to the longer distances, where they belong. No, I wasn’t there and am glad I didn’t see that. I think it’s the veterinary controls that stop it. I really don’t believe adding points at a national level is going to undo the good done by the controls. The veterinary controls are very important--don't get me wrong. But you really are avoiding the issue here. The fact that the LD rides do not count for AERC career endurance miles, but are instead in their own category, is still a factor that keeps the rider in search of competition and recognition from racing the bejesus out of his horse for the LD win when he can Top Ten the 50, get the same points, and have his mileage count. That is STILL an important part of the "control" of the LD rides, whether you care to acknowledge it or not. The friendly sort of racing that we see now doesn't even hold a candle to it. Nor do the majority of LD riders come to race. Only a small handful do, and often they are the ones of most concern to the vets at the rides, too. They usually get their come-uppance at the BC awards where they get last place over someone that was fit to go that fast. Which is an argument for LD BC – it’s educational. Yes--which is why the BC is so important, and why I will continue to champion that cause. But make no mistake about it--taking away the AERC points was one of the most crucial safety decisions that was ever made, and it rates right up there with the stricter and different veterinary controls that we have at the shorter distances. Bruce is right on target on this one. I don’t agree with you on this. I see people run awfully hard for PNER points, and I think the controls are what did the job. I think you could put the points back, and not see the problems come back. I guess I must ride on a different planet. I haven't seen it. And I still maintain that the racing we see now doesn't hold a candle to what happened back then. Maybe you had to be there to understand. Heidi =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Ridecamp is a service of Endurance Net, http://www.endurance.net. Information, Policy, Disclaimer: http://www.endurance.net/Ridecamp Subscribe/Unsubscribe http://www.endurance.net/ridecamp/logon.asp Ride Long and Ride Safe!! =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
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