shagyas 101 - purebreds?

[Todd & Toni Jones <tjones@coinet.com>]

Hi Lif,

The Shagya owners/breeders do consider our horses as much purebred
(purebred Shagya) as any breed can be considered a purebred. The Babolna
studbooks were carefully and accurately kept from 1789 to now and they are
still in existence for all to see. The only written studbook in existence
older than the Shagya studbooks are the English Thoroughbred. Because of
the recordkeeping of the Hungarians, the World Arabian Horse Organization
opted to recognize the Shagya as a separate breed of Arabian horse. (WAHO
recognizes 3 types of Arabians, the Purebred, the Half-Bred, and the
Shagya) The parent world society is the International Shagya Society or
known by the initials as "ISG". Up until the name "Shagya" was adopted in
the 1970's the breed was known in Europe as "Araberrasse" (Arabian-bred),
"Part-bred Arabs", "Hungarian-bred Arabians" or "Babolna Arabs" as opposed
to Purebred Arabians which are and were exactly that.

When the breed first came to the United States in the mid 1980's, the
founders of the North American Shagya Society or NASS did look into having
IAHA handle the registering and so forth. But it was decided that it would
not be feasible for them to do so for a variety of reasons. Some articles
I've read or come across argue that since the Shagya's foundation stock
(going back to the beginning of the breed's studbooks in 1789) brood mares
were of mixed breeds (TB, Arabs, Arab X, etc.) and therefore the Shagya
cannot be considered a "purebred Arabian" and therefore must be a separate
breed. The Hungarians had to start somewhere with their broodmare band and
so used the best they had available in terms of performance tested mares
that had "been there, done that" in the cavalry and had attributes they
wished to pass on. From that point forward no other blood was mixed other
than desertbred Arabians imported from various tribes in Syria and around
there.

An interesting thing to note is that many of the desert-bred Arabian
stallions used for Shagya breeding can also be seen in old purebred Arabian
pedigrees today, especially those from Janow Podlaski Stud in Poland. The
old time breeders often would use the stallion for a few years and then
they would move on to another line, always seeking to improve what they
had.

Another reason the IAHA couldn't handle the registry was that the purebreds
of this breed must be inspected and approved in order to be licensed for
breeding. Something that IAHA couldn't easily handle with all the other
things they do. Since Shagyas have their own registry, you don't see this
breed showing at the IAHA shows unless it's a half-Arab/Part Shagya being
shown in the half-Arab classes. For breeding of purebred Shagyas they must
be bloodtyped. I am told by other breeders who have looked into it that the
Shagya has as many "markers" in their blood as any horse recognized as a
purebred Arabian in this country. I really don't know what the technical
terms would be. Since the Shagya has only used desert-bred Arabians for
outcrossing or Shagya to Shagya, I don't know what else you would call the
breed. The formula was Shagya to Shagya for 3 generations then outcross the
4th to desertbred stallions and back to Shagya to Shagya, etc. The careful
linebreeding "set" in the traits that the Shagya was and is known for. Most
of the Shagyas competing in the world do so in 3-day eventing, dressage,
jumping or driving. A few do distance riding, just not many here yet.

So, in a long roundabout way in the effort to answer your question. I would
say, and this is only me, not Shagya breeders at large, that the Shagya
carries as much Arabian blood as any purebred arabian carries. However, due
to the efforts of the Hungarians I would have to say that the the WAHO has
it right when they say the Shagya is "a separate breed of Arabian horse".
They developed/linebred a breed for a their own purposes and that carried
them away from the mainstream purebred Arabian. Personally, I've owned
purebred arabians, and arab X, (not to mention Anglo, QH, Appy, Morgan,
Shetland and Welsh). O'Biwon is my first Shagya (and my first stallion).
They are different than the purebred arabians I've met or owned. They look
different (although obviously arab-influenced), they act different. They
are just different, for the most part. For people who would like to see
more photos of them, (including mine) go to www.shagya.com. The website is
comprised of many of us across America who own and love this breed. There
are also helpful articles.

Sorry for being so long winded, and hopefully this cleared up some
confusion. Or created a lot more! :)

Toni Jones
Willow Creek Farms
Shagya Stallion O'Biwon
Prineville, Oregon


Lif Strand wrote:

> Toni - After reading your excellent post, I am curious as to why people
> refer to Shagyas as Arabians (or Shagya Arabians)?  I noticed that in
> your post you made reference to some of the other horses you've ridden
> as "my other Arabians".  I have seen these references before and
> actually have read articles defending the notion that Shagyas are
> purebred Arabians.  Could you comment on this?  Thanks, Lif
>
> --
>                                      ____________
> Lif & Paul Strand   STRAND ENTERPRISES   http://www.fasterhorses.com
>            Arabian Horses for Distance Riding
>          Internet Research * WebArt * Fine Art
>     Nutrition and alternatives for self-reliant people
>                      Quemado, NM  USA






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