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> > > Well, I'm trying to figure out where you got the idea he's got bad ground
manners. <snip> don't quite get where everyone seems to think I'm hurrying
things just
walking him down the trail after 3 mo. under saddle. I guess never having
had an arena it seems very normal to me to break a horse on the trail.<<<

Well, lets see.......First, the manners....you opened a door, and he fired
out at it with both barrels....and when your trainer walked over to him, she
got kicked, and you said it was hard enough it is draining??? Horses with
good ground manners do NOT kick at people....

Now, as far as hurrying things....first, I don't have an arena either, and
also break them on the trail. But a horse that leaps, kicks out, and BOLTS,
has some holes in his training, that you need to consider. It could just be
lack of "Whoa now or I WILL feed you to the dogs", or it could be
desensitizing issues. (which to me, goes back the whoa thing, as a horse
that spooks, should still stop when told to do so)  I make sure they know
WHOA.Before I ever get on them, I do lots of walking with a lead, and
stopping when I say WHOA. They some only need a lead rope, some need a rope
halter, some need a shank. But when I check that lead, and say "whoa", they
are not to take one more step. Then, when I start riding them, I do lots of
"whoa" work again. Lots and lots of starts and stops at the walk, then trot,
then canter. You can do it in a ring, or you can do it on the trail. But
"whoa" means now.

Yes, everyone has different methods. You have things that work for you, and
might not work for me. I'm sure the suggestions have been a huge variety of
things to try. But the bottom line is, you are potentially at risk of
getting hurt with this horse if some of these actions continue.  Often it is
difficult to see where the real problem is with a horse when they are our
own. Try to stand back, and look at some of the actions of this horse as if
it belonged to someone else. Does it do any little things you would never
tolerate a friends horse to do.  Often those little things, build up into
the larger issues, which had you posting to the list, looking for
suggestions.

Again, good luck with him. We don't want the next post from your household
that the horse kicked you,or a family member and you are hurt....or worst.
Another thought just popped in my mind. A curiosity actually. When he kicked
the trainer, was he punished?

Jonni



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