Re: RC: Fwd: RC: RE: Cause and Effect, horse accidents happen

[Laura Nielsen <lsn@bellsouth.net>]

Keri,

I was the rider that was kicked by Rockie's horse.

I was in front and was passed by Rockie, without warning, on a 2-track trail with
open grassland on both sides.  I was particularly surprised, as Rockie had been
asked to "please" keep her horse behind ours.  This was after her horse had
kicked mine in the chest earlier during the ride, when she cut in front of me.
This was also not the first time this horse had kicked during training rides, so
I was careful to stay out of range.

To make this very clear to all of you who jump to conclusions:  I was kicked when
Rockie's horse passed mine.

Any more questions or anyone wanting more clarification, e-mail me privately.

Laura,
N.Fla


Endure4fun@aol.com wrote:

> In a message dated 8/9/99 7:38:37 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
> bobmorris@rmci.net writes:
>
> <<  is interesting that you titled the message as cause and effect. Realize
>  that your horse kicking is not just some "out of the air, whim" it is in
>  reaction of the interplay between the TWO  horses involved and based on
>  senses that you cannot recognize.
>   >>
> If I read correctly, these two riders had been riding together for some time,
> not just that day, but as friends do.  As with people, horses do have off
> days.  Yes, the rider shouldn't have been that close, but if they always rode
> that way you shouldn't really blame the injured rider or horse.  If front
> rider knew that her horse kicked I'm sure the second rider would have known
> that too as they are friends and rode often.  Since it was a first time kick,
> who is to say who is at fault?  If it was my horse that kicked out, I would
> disciplined him for his incorrect behavior and know now that my horse will
> kick at a "buddy," and hopefully we both (riders) learned a lesson.  I know
> it was the horse that kicked, but remember, they usually give a signal first,
> ears back, swishing of tail, mood change, etc., and the rider of said horse
> should know her animal well enough to read these signs and take control.
> I know there will be lots of people flaming me for this, but it is up to us
> as riders to be responsible for our horses.
> Keri
>
>   ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Subject: RC: RE: Cause and Effect, horse accidents happen
> Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 19:38:51 -0700 (PDT)
> Resent-From: ridecamp@endurance.net
> Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 20:35:24 -0600
> From: "Bob Morris" <bobmorris@rmci.net>
> To: <RUNAWAYWOM@aol.com>
> CC: "RideCamp" <ridecamp@endurance.net>
>
> It is interesting that you titled the message as cause and effect. Realize
> that your horse kicking is not just some "out of the air, whim" it is in
> reaction of the interplay between the TWO  horses involved and based on
> senses that you cannot recognize.
>
> Your horse was kicking in the normal manner of one provoked, i.e. to give a
> warning by just missing the provoking horse's shoulder. Sadly to say that is
> where the rides knee most likely will be at the time.
>
> NOW,  are you to punish your horse when provoked by another? Yes, it is fine
> to say you should turn the other cheek but that is for humans. Animals do
> not react in such a manner!
>
> Then there is the thought, why was your friend that close to your horse.
> Courtesy demands at least  one horse length between horses. Perhaps there
> was a very good reason for your horse to kick in warning. Again, sorry
> friend, but you were endangering both your self and the rider in front of
> you.  I feel, having been there myself many times, that the blame should be
> placed on the party that causes the action. NO PROXIMITY NO INJURY!
>
> To often the horse in front is blamed and the rider is caught up in the
> controversy when the person who caused the problem, while injured, gets the
> sympathy while also they should be getting the blame.
>
> I am ready to defend this position with equine psychology, actual experience
> and anecdotal evidence. Any one want to dispute or flame me go to it.
>
> Bob Morris
> Morris Endurance Enterprises
> Boise, ID
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From:   RUNAWAYWOM@aol.com [mailto:RUNAWAYWOM@aol.com]
> Sent:   Monday, August 09, 1999 7:13 PM
> To:     LSimoni197@aol.com; ridecamp@endurance.net
> Cc:     Marinera@aol.com; aerc@foothill.net; otdumas@laplaza.org;
> sallijan@ix.netcom.com
> Subject:        RC:     Cause and Effect, horse accidents happen
>
> LYNGE,
>              I agree with your post. My horse was the cause of an accident
> with a friend of mine. My horse kicked out at her horse, and kicked her
> instead, she had a knee injury and needed stitches. I was very sorry about
> this and apologized for my horse. I also have been working hard to
> discourage
> this behavior in my young alpha horse.
> My point is, that it was an accident and accidents happen. My friend will no
> longer ride with me if I am riding this horse. I have been riding and
> competing for 9 years and have never had anything like this happen, and I
> hope it never happens again.
> Rockie
>
> =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
> Ridecamp is a service of Endurance Net, http://www.endurance.net.
> Information, Policy, Disclaimer: http://www.endurance.net/RideCamp
> =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
>
> =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
> Ridecamp is a service of Endurance Net, http://www.endurance.net.
> Information, Policy, Disclaimer: http://www.endurance.net/RideCamp
> =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=




=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Ridecamp is a service of Endurance Net, http://www.endurance.net.    
Information, Policy, Disclaimer: http://www.endurance.net/RideCamp   
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=