Re: LD Rules

[terre <tobytrot@bigfoot.com>]

At 11:34 AM 22/09/98 -0400, you wrote:

>Everytime I'm ready to send in my dues and join AERC one of these LD
>Discussions comes up, and I feel, well, unwelcome.  What if I never do get
>To ride a 50?  If I'm LD forever?  How am I viewed?   Please read on:
>
Jude, I am very, very sorry if my posts have made you feel
"unwelcome"--such was certainly not my intention.  I am NOT unappreciative
of LD riders; on the contrary, I feel that some of you guys are being
unfairly used to subsidize the longer distances.  Let me try to be clearer
about my position:
You, and every single LD rider reading this, are/will be a wonderful asset
for AERC, as a member or as a participant.  I know this, because you are
truly interested in endurance; otherwise you would not be spending an hour
or so a day reading ridecamp!  You will not mind joining AERC, or failing
that paying the non-member charge, anymore than the 50+ milers do and for
the same reason--you are in love!  But consider, for a moment, the "other
guys".  What about folks who just kinda show up to do one or maybe two
rides in a season, because they are close to home.  All they want to do is
try riding a marked trail, and see what a vet check is like.  Most of them
will never do a "season" of LD rides, or aspire to ride 50s, or join
AERC--they just want to have fun. How fair is it to these people to expect
them to pay high entries and fees to an organization that in no way
represents their interests?  Is there to be no place in this sport for
them, unless they pay and pay?  Do you not think these charges will
discourage them from even giving us a try?  I am a ride manager
sometimes--I tend to think of these people as "guests" to our sport.  I
feel bad about charging them big bucks for the privilege of riding 10 or 20
miles on public land!  How welcome is a high entry fee going to make them
feel?


>Terre said: From: terre <tobytrot@bigfoot.com>
>
>>are resistant to change?  Well, I am--when it is a change for the worse.
>>As to LD riders controlling AERC......Now if I have this right--first of
>>all, 800+ former AERC members "forgot" to renew their memberships, then you
>>state in EN that most of the "growth" is in LD, with little increase in
>>Endurance numbers, and then you replied to a post of Heidi's that
>>membership is at an all time high.  Logic leads me to conclude that many of
>>these members are LD, no?  Additionally, we now have (I agree!) a really
>>great sponsorship program from Sundowner subsidizing NEW memberships--and
>>there will predicably be more new LD riders starting each year than new
>>Endurance riders.  As you say, the majority vote will decide, now and in
>>the future.  But you don't think LD will end up controlling the
>>organization?  That's reassuring.
>Could I join if I promised not to vote?  Or that I wouldn't call myself an
>"Endurance
>Rider"? 

Jude, this was intended as an exercise in logic!  Randy said he wasn't
worried about LD riders becoming a voting majority; I was simply saying
that by his figures it seems probable.


 Really, I'm not trying to inflame anyone, this is just how this
>post (and
>Others in the past from folks on this subject) make me feel.     I honestly
>don't know
>If I should join or not!  I don't have a guarantee that I'll ever be able
>to reach my goal
>Of riding 50 mile rides…I don't have any desire to "control" an
>organization, I'd like
>To be part of AERC (I really appreciate the fact that they put on LD rides
>and help to
>Educate riders like me)  BTW, I haven't ever felt this attitude at a ride,
>maybe I'm
>Answering my own question.

Of course you should join (if you can afford it)!  NONE of us has a
guarantee of reaching our goals--that's why it's a challenge.  And if you
do join, it becomes your obligation to vote, and do your part to contribute
to the future of the organization.
>
>Then Terre continued:	
>
>>I am not "anti-LD" at all--if fact I think mandatory sanctioning treats LD
>>(and now potentially "fun") riders unfairly, by forcing them to pay fees to
>>an "endurance" organization when they are not riding endurance.  So here is
>>a counter proposal (in an effort to offer something other than criticism of
>>the hard-working and ever-suffering Board!):
>>	Why not give LD their own "association" like AERC
>>International--voluntary, self-supporting, and self-governing?  Their fees
>>go to support LD awards, and they vote on LD issues--always subject to AERC
>>rules and principles.  Just one alternative......
>
>Terre
>
>So, how welcome does that make someone like me feel?  There must be others
>Our there in similar situations……BTW, I would not object to paying a
>non-member
>Fee to ride LD, but I'd rather be a member!  How do other real endurance
>riders feel?

Jude, why does that make you feel unwelcome?  You say you want to do 50s,
but there are many LD riders who don't--for their own, valid reasons, they
want to stay with LD.  Don't you think it would be better for them if their
membership fees went to fund only the LD program, and if they got to choose
for themselves the formats under which their rides are held (race vs
completion only, etc) without interference from people (like me) who don't
even ride LD?  Comparable, as I said, to AERC International, which is (I
repeat) self-supporting, self-governing, voluntary.
>
>Ø Wow, I think this was longer (and intenser) than the first one!
>
>Yeah, more pointed….I really don't think you made your points with any
>malice intended,
>But it does make someone "sitting on the fence" trying to decide whether it
>is appropriate
>To join AERC very hesitant!
>
Of course it's appropriate!  Just expensive!

(One amusing aspect of this debate:  Jude refers to not calling herself
"endurance". It reminds me of the discussion a few months back of LD riders
wanting to call themselves "endurance riders", and 50+ milers frowning on
the  term.  I wonder how LD riders like Jude, who have clearly put
themselves through the mill to get through 25 mile rides, will feel if 10
mile riders are calling themselves LD--half the distance, same title.
Sound familiar?)

Jude, my "problem" is with the mandatory sanctioning of LD rides, and now
the proposed mandatory sanctioning of even shorter rides. It is not, not,
not with LD riders!  I love you guys!  I used to be one of you!  I think
you are being taken unfair advantage of!

Terre