RideCamp@endurance.net
Fwd: Paint and pinto coloring
OK, I've been quiet about this as long as I can. Lets see if I can explain
this:
In a message dated 12/1/98 10:11:50 AM EST, helgeson@lansford.ndak.net writes:
<<
OK, what exactly is in the "genes." If a horse has a dominant overo gene they
will show it in some way.
****Overo has been "in controversy" for years, two solid horses have been
known to throw an overo foal...how?? let the experts try that one.
A dominant gene will show on the horse, whereas if the gene does not show it
is considered recessive.
*****Normally, Yes, but the overo gene is confusing. Maybe it takes the overo
gene paired with another gene in order to show up on the horse?
like some traits are sex linked, etc.
And a horse that is carrying a recessive overo or tobiano gene can not in any
way throw that gene and turn it in to a dominant gene that is going to show on
their offspring.
****Tobiano is dominant, you must have a tobiano parent in order to get a
tobiano foal. This is proven.
There has to be at least one parent that has the dominant gene in order for
there to be a paint foal.
****For the sake of example: You do not need to have a dominat gene in order
to get a specific color: Chestnut is recessive, but if both parents "give"
their recessive chestnut gene, you get a chestnut foal. Recessive genes can be
very sneaky. I have two chestnut horses that are out of grey parents! These
two horses, bred together will never throw a grey foal, even though all four
grandparents were grey.
Sometimes the parent will have the dominate overo gene and it will be hard to
find evidence that that parent carries the dominant gene, but it has to be
dominant.
****Again, the jury is still out about overo. Some sources say its dominant,
others say its recessive. It sometimes responds as both.
So most breeding stock paints are carrying the recessive overo
gene and they will never produce a paint foal without being bred to a
paint.
****If both parents carry a recessive gene (and give it to the offspring), the
foal can be homozygous for the recessive trait. Just like my two chestnut
horses from grey parents. Grey is dominant, you will not get a grey foal out
of non grey parents, but you can get other colors from grey parents. ( you do
understand that all animals carry two genes for each trait, one from mom and
one from dad)
You can breed two tobianos together and come up with a solid and still
register it as a breeding stock paint/pinto.
****This is where the recessive genes carried by both parents come into
action.
And there is no way that horse will ever produce a paint/pinto by itself.
****Overo foals can be produced by non spotted parents. I agree with the
sabino, and splash patterns being grouped as overo, BTW
I hope I explained this OK. There are two color genes in each animal. One from
Mom and one from Dad. If both the genes are the same, the foal in homozygous,
if they are different, the foal is heterozygous. If the foal is homozygous-
the color could be recessive or dominant. If the foal is heterozygous- one
color is dominant over the other, but this heterozygous foal could grow up and
produce a foal of it's own- this baby could acquire either the dominant or
recessive gene from its heterozygous parent. Coat colors have always
fascinated me. BTW, as a breeder of Welsh ponies, we have lots of
Sabino/Splash foals, and they are registerable.
Leigh Preddy SE
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Dbeverly4@aol.com wrote:
>
> As an owner of some breeding stock registered Paint horses I would have to
> differ with this opinion. Breeding stock Paint horses can produce color
> without the benefit of another Paint horse. It is in the genes.
>
> Sylvia
OK, what exactly is in the "genes." If a horse has a dominant overo gene
they will show it in some way. A dominant gene will show on the horse,
whereas is the gene does not show it is considered recessive. And a
horse that is carrying a recessive overo or tobiano gene can not in any
way throw that gene and turn it in to a dominant gene that is going to
show on their offspring. There has to be at least one parent that has
the dominant gene in order for there to be a paint foal. Sometimes the
parent will have the dominate overo gene and it will be hard to find
evidence that that parent carries the dominant gene, but it has to be
dominant. So most breeding stock paints are carrying the recessive overo
gene and they will never produce a paint foal without being bred to a
paint.
You can breed two tobianos together and come up with a solid and still
register it as a breeding stock paint/pinto. And there is no way that
horse will ever produce a paint/pinto by itself. But it can be
registered as such. Which just goes to prove that the registries are
doing that to make extra money and it makes me angry, because people are
buying these registered breeding stock paint/pintos thinking that they
could throw color when there is no way that is going to happen. The
registries are leading people to believe that, breeders are getting more
money for these solid non producing color breeders, and the horse people
are the ones being mislead. I breed pintos to an solid Arab stallion and
I have a solid filly out of that cross that could be registered as a
breeding stock pinto. But I will not register her that way and when I am
asked by potential buyers, which I have been asked, if she will throw
color because of her background I always tell them no, she will not
contribute the color gene. If I had lied and told them that she is
registered as a breeding stock pinto, so therefore she could produce
color then I would have had her sold by now. But, I will not mislead
people into thinking that she will throw color in order to make some
extra money off of her or get her sold. I do not believe in being
dishonest in order to make an extra buck.
Ok, all right, I am getting off of my soapbox. I don't climb up there
very often, but this situation with the registries is just not right.
Lynette
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