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> As to the French Arabs--most, (not all) of the ones I've ever seen
have
> been built like true sprinters--NOT like distance horses.
Yes, true, I never said differently. This sure is the result of selection for
short bursts of speed. The French rarely use arabians straight from the
racecourse as endurance horses either! They hunt for a line with good stayer
qualities, superior health to boot, and breed that individual to renowned
endurance performers quite often, however. Especially if they want to go
"fast" and short.
> 1. the loin coupling is broad, and set halfway between the ideal for the
> riding and racing types, that is, not as far back as on a racing horse
(speed
...snip
> as fast as one with a more behind coupling--their muscular leverage is
> functionally stronger--but not geometrically as great--)
What you say coincides with what I also think are some main differences in
conformation between racers and endurance horses. What is different is that I
got taught in gaited horse breeding that gaited horses preferably have
"disjoints" (one of which is in the loin), to enable them to engage in a
smoother toelt in an easier way.
> 2. The overall body balance of an endurance horse is level, rather than "
> downhill" as in a sprinter, or "uphill" as in a smooth walking gaited
breed.
...snip
> An endurance horse needs a frame somewhere in between these two extremes,
> and the best ones have it---
There again I have some problems with the conformation you cite of gaited
breeds. The Icelander for example is not at all built "uphill", in fact a
highly higher than the withers crupper and a steep decline of the crupper is
regarded as an asset! The major trainers of gaited TBs and Trotters here in
Europe especially hunt for this type of conformation to be able to teach the
horses to toelt. I wonder whether the reason is that the way horses are
toelted is different from e.g. the way saddlebreds or THWs do? In my
experience especially the latter has a very different rhythm. Generally over
here the gaited breeds are especially not asked to travel "collected", they
are asked to travel disjointed and completely relaxed. However - there never
is the impression that these horses travel on their forehands!!!
> 3. The chest is narrow from side to side but deep from top to bottom.
> Sprinters tend to be barrel chested--i.e. their chest is barrel shaped.
Look
...snip
> -15 seconds? Heck, those horses don't even have to breath--15 seconds!
> Nothing in the world will catch 'em for those 15 seconds though!
Yes, absolutely correct! Funny to see that so clearly said, as the common
european opinion of "much room" still is that of broad chest and round
ribcage, there are reams of conformation descriptions who ask for barrel
shaped chests, because those are said to be ideal for better
stamina/breathing. Funny thing then, that nearly all of the enduring and fast
breeds don't have that (apart from the short bursts breeds, like you
said)...isn't it?
> I would reject as
> an endurance prospect any animal with less than a cannon-tendon
circumference
...snip
> It is my feeling this is not enough even for a racehorse, but their short
> term of use on the track allows most of them to get away with it.
No, sorry. That is indeed true for coarse-grained breeds, like WBs, northern
strains, etc.. Not true for fine-grained breeds - the density of the bone
matter/cells is what counts, the less dense, elastic and hard, the broader a
cannon bone must be to support work and weight, the denser, more elastic and
harder, the more this bone is capable to support per square centimeter in
work and weight. That's physics, quite simply. If you have a very
fine-grained, hard bone the cannon usually *is* less in circumference than
else and the leg does not suffer. This is one main reason why crossbreeding
bears dangers, breed a horse with small cannon circumference and hard bone
structure to one with a broad cannon and "soft", coarse-grained structure and
you stand the chance at getting a foal which has the small circumference and
the soft, coarse bone structure - very negative! As to TBs and their
fragility in this - they are bred for speed and are only a short time in
work, they don't need more than what they have, on a scale of cellular grain
they certainly do not yet belong to the really fine-grained breeds. And as
long as you don't select for something like this, you won't get it. The
reason why they have "less" is also logical, less weight to pump at each
stride.
> By the way, most horses called "cow-hocked" really arn't. If a horse
stands
> with his hocks pointing towards each other he is not, necessarily,
cow-hocked.
...snip
> angle from one joint to the next. Watch out for any changes in angles!--
> there is trouble in the making!
There are several breeds whose breeders regard those "false" cow-hocks as an
asset, rather than a conformation fault. Especially among all breeds which
are used on hilly or mountaineous terrain. E.g. the health-wise unremarkable
cow-hock is state of art among the Kabardin horses of the Caucase mountains,
the breeders do not breed it out, as those horses deal a lot better with the
steep terrain than those which are "correctly" legged.
> 5.An endurance horse needs large, smooth joints. A racehorse can "get by"
...snip
> the difference, I guarentee it.
Oh very yes! Naturally!!!
> While some show good cannon-tendon circumfrerence, many, many show legs
...snip
> extend freely--
A long cannon need not be weak! I know, I know, sacrilege...As you well know
I come from the Akhal Teke, our horses *have* very long cannons and they are
enduring and sound! Their bone matter however belongs to the densest you
could find if you hunted a long time. There are other, mostly oriental and
african, breeds, which have also quite long cannons and still are very sound
and enduring, e.g. the Dongola, various indian breeds, the turkish common
horses (and boyo, they do get work those ones!), several persian strains of
Arab and Persian Arab, and so on. There also are quite some hooved and
split-hooved wild animals which have both - thin cannons and long ones,
relative to their mean body mass, they thrive. A mark of all this is the
quality of bone, it's again physics. A longer cannon has certain plus points
regarding speed (short and long distance speed). You can built a bridge pier
in stone and in steel, guess which is thinner? You can forge a sword in iron
and in steel and in folded steel, guess which is the thinnest?!
As the arabian's bone structure certainly is much denser, finer-grained and
more elastic than that of the TB or WBs, it can get away with much in this
respect and stay sound. If you breed them for speed, you get speed-relevant
characteristica, still the arab racehorse is a lot hardier than the TB!
Though I certainly wouldn't recommend breeding any which breed for long
cannons, I however contend, that relevant to bone structure/matter there is
an ideal length and circumference, which **differs** from breed to breed and
even within certain breeds from strain to strain. This means in short: there
is absolutely no way to lump all breeds together, you may thus give up
plus-points which would do you good in performance! I'd go for the horse with
long cannons and the implied higher over-all speed, if it can have them and
stay as sound as a short-cannoned one - under the same work. And cannon
lengths need to be viewed also relative to forearm length...
The being tied in is the main serious conformation fault I'd see in that
horse(not as an endurance prospect, but simply as a horse), as this really
bears on the function of the sinews and leg. There you are absolutely right!
Generally I believe that conformation must always be viewed along with the
basic organic/cellular material it is built from. One simply cannot compare a
concrete-and-steel skyscraper with a loam-brick-built single storey and vice
versa! What is needful for one, may be superfluous for the other. Only
relating both material and built gives you the full scope of what is possible
and what not. As the architects of gothic cathedrals soon found out...
Greetings,
AT
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