RE: RE: RE: It's a Drug???

["Kathy Mayeda" <kathy_mayeda@atce.com>]

So what's a DRUG?  

I have no argument that drugs are not needed, nor wanted, for
top competition.  Just need to clarify what's "nutrician" vs. "drug".


k.

-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Morris [mailto:bobmorris@rmci.net]
Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2001 5:32 PM
To: Kathy Mayeda; Truman Prevatt, PhD; Joy VanNoy; RideCamp
Subject: RC: RE: RE: It's a Drug???


Interesting, to me Rule 13 is very simple and forthright!  It states
that no
drugs will be allowed. Forget the rest, just no drugs allowed. Now you
get
the jail house lawyers and they want to argue that certain things are
not
drugs because the Government does not so classify them. Well, Foxglove
is
not a drug but would you feed it to your horse? Caffeine is a very
common
substance and is not classified as a drug but would you feed  a latte to
your horse?
The whole argument for being very definitive about the drugs and wanting
to
name them is simply a ruse to find the ones not named and then use them.

Our rule is simple NO DRUGS. The rule then provided for a penalty if it
is
found that you are using them. It provides for one accepted form of
recognition and that is the testing for drugs. If a rider cannot accept
that, as the rule states, ENDURANCE EQUINES MUST COMPETE ENTIRELY ON
THEIR
NATURAL ABILITY,  then those particular riders should at some period in
time
expect to be censured.

We have never had a problem with the Rule 13 and my wife and I have
competed
in local, regional, national and International competitions. Generally
placing in the top ten and with horses that have gone as much as 5000
miles
with out a non-finish.

I will clearly state DRUGS OF ANY FORM ARE NOT NECESSARY FOR TOP
COMPETITION. I defy any one to prove me wrong.

Bob Morris


-----Original Message-----
From: Kathy Mayeda [mailto:kathy_mayeda@atce.com]
Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2001 5:48 PM
To: Truman Prevatt, PhD; Joy VanNoy; RideCamp
Subject: RC: RE: It's a Drug???


Rule 13 is very confusing to me and I would like to see it re-written
so that it is in black and white which particular substances are
violations.

Like Pro-Burst?  Is that considered "legal" because in my mind it
is pretty much along the lines of APF.  And this whole "endogenous
substance" thing.......  I'M SOOOOOO CONFUSED.........

It seems to me that Rule 13 leaves a whole lot to interpretation.  Maybe
it's deliberately left that way so that each ride vet could interpret
it the way they want.  But that makes a whole lot of unknown for
the endurance competitor.

I agree with you, Truman, that AERC may need to "bite the bullet" and
revisit this issue.   Maybe the veterinary committee needs to decide
that certain substances are okay if they; 1) do no harm and 2) do not
mask any symptoms of any kind of biomechanical or metabolic stress.

And then they should LIST those substances as they develope.

I don't think this issue will go away because more and more substances
are being developed to tempt the endurance competitor.

K.





-----Original Message-----
From: Truman Prevatt, PhD [mailto:truman.prevatt@netsrq.com]
Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2001 2:51 PM
To: Joy VanNoy; RideCamp
Subject: RC: It's a Drug???


You might want to see my previous post on this subject. While you claim
this is "not a drug" you are touting it for its pharmacological effect.
A substance with a pharmacological effect  is a drug plain a simple.
While it may not be on the FDA list of "drugs", it is a drug none the
less because and as you have said it does have a pharmacological effect.


Whether it test or not is a separate issue and whether it should not be
used is also a separate issue. But it is technically in violation of
Rule 13.  But so is Adaquan, Cosequin, etc. This is why I sure would
like to see the AERC bite the bullet and revisit this issue head on.


What's really scary about this post is I am starting to sound like Bob
Morris:-).


Truman.


Joy VanNoy wrote:


First, let me say that I appreciate the opportunity Miss Swigart's post
has given me to state (perhaps more clearly this time) what APF is - AND
IS NOT. APF is a food supplement.  APF is not a drug nor a nutraceutical
and is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease.
Adaptogens have already been scrutinized by both the scientific and
regulatory communities and classified as nutrients (sometimes called
phyto-nutrients to indicate they are derived exclusively from plant
sources).  All the herbs in APF are already on the GRAS list of the
United States.  Other listed substances are wheat, barley and corn.
(GRAS stands for Generally Recognized As Safe.)  Opium, digitalis and
valerian, while plant based, are NOT on this list.



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