Whips and Spurs in Endurance

["guest@endurance.net" <guest@endurance.net>]

K S SWIGART   katswig@earthlink.net


At 10:28 AM 09/21/2000 -0700, you wrote:
>K S SWIGART   katswig@earthlink.net
>Let's get one thing straight here, in the AERC, whips and spurs
>are not disallowed.  In FEI, only "spurs are prohibited" (and a
>stupid rule if ever I heard one).

> I don't think it is stupid.  I have seen horses abused with spurs, and
> IMO, damn few riders know how to use them properly.

On this, you and I will agree.  Damn few riders (especially endurance 
riders) know how to use them properly.  That doesn't mean that you 
should prohibit their use by people who do.  And I have seen horses 
abused with lead ropes and reins, but that doesn't mean I think we ought 
to pass a rule that says riders aren't allowed to use them.

> I would consider a helmet safety equipment, but spurs?  

Yes, spurs. Like a helmet, you don't need them most of the time, but 
when you do need them, you are damn glad to have them.


> I have seen very few riders on endurance rides use spurs properly, and 
> some of the worst abuses I've ever seen at rides have been by 
riders wearing spurs. 

> My horses have over 6000 miles and I can't think of a single instance
> where having spurs on them would have been helpful.

And I have ridden more than 4000 miles and I can't think of a single 
instance where having a helmet would have been helpful, but that doesn't 
mean I don't think other people should be allowed to use one if they 
think it is an important piece of equipment.

Besides, if I remember correctly, your horse fell off a single track 
trail at Swanton this year.  I wasn't there to see it, so I don't know 
if it applies in your case, but I have found that one of the most useful 
places for spurs is in keeping horses from putting their foot wrong on a 
single track trail...and falling off of it.

It may be the reason you can't think of where spurs would have been 
helpful is because you don't know how to use them properly either.  But 
just because you don't doesn't mean that I don't.

>>... or b) they are of the opinion that endurance
>>riders are a bunch of intermediate riders who don't know how to
>>use spurs properly and therefore should be banned from using them
>>because they are more likely to use them improperly.

>I agree with b.

I suspect so as well.  And if the FEI has a rule for their world 
championship events based upon the assumption that all of their riders 
are intermediate riders and don't know how to ride properly, then I can 
only say that it is a bad (and rather condescending) rule.

I can just imagine if the FEI were to try to pass a rule in eventing 
prohibiting riders from wearing spurs because they assume that the 
riders don't know how to use them properly.  To go out on an FEI level 
cross country course without spurs on is just plain dangerous.

> Come on, if a rider 
> doesn't have control of their horse without spurs they shouldn't be 
> out on the trail.
  
and 

> While I agree that spurs do have their place, I think a horse should 
be 
> trained well enough to go down an endurance trail without them.  If a 
> rider can't control or move his/her horse with their leg/heel then 
they 
> probably should take some lessons and learn.

And I could say that if a rider doesn't know how to get more precise 
movement from their horse by using spurs and have enough control over 
their lower leg to not use spurs improperly, then they should probably 
take some lessons and learn.  But I won't.  I will assume that riders 
are intelligent and responsible enough to choose to use the right 
equipment for their own horses and their own level of expertise.  

Additionally, using spurs properly is tricky:  it requires a completely 
independent seat, it requires that the rider know which leg the horse is 
moving when (without looking), and it requires the timing to apply the 
aid at just the right moment in just the right place in order to get the 
horse to alter the flight pattern of its foot.  It is not riders who 
know how to "control" their horse with the use of spurs that would 
benefit from lessons; it is riders that don't.

And let's get this straight:  for most riders, on most horses, in most 
saddles it is physically impossible to apply your heel to the horse 
without losing your proper leg position and removing your knee from 
where it belongs.  Yes it is true that some horses are so highly trained 
that you don't need to apply your heel and you can merely push down your 
weight in the stirrup and use what Podahjsky calls the "invisible aids."  
But I have yet to see ANY endurance horse trained to this level.  And to 
be honest with you, I doubt even those horses that are highly trained 
enough to do so could do so in all instances no matter what the 
distractions out on the trail for 50 to 100 miles.

It is also true that a good many endurance riders don't care or wouldn't 
notice if they lose their leg position when they put their heel on the 
horse...but _I_ do.  If I have spurs on it is very easy for me to give a 
horse a light reminder to take a slightly longer step with its hind leg 
to, say, step over that rock that I have seen and they may not have, 
while at the same time keeping my knee where it belongs so that the 
horse doesn't fall out at the shoulder.  And this is true on all levels 
of horses...even green ones (and lets face it, we DO have to ride green 
horses sometimes).

Spurs allow a competent rider to lightly apply the most subtle of aids 
to get the most precise of movement from the back end of the horse.  
There is NO aid that is more effective for "controlling" the placement 
of the back end of the horse.

Yes, it is true that many endurance riders don't know how to do this 
properly, and it is also true that many endurance riders don't know or 
care what the horse is doing with its back end and just assume that the 
back end will follow the front end, but I like to be able to operate the 
back end and the front end of my horses separately from each other, and 
I repeat, spurs are THE MOST effective aid for doing this.  

AND (here's where the safety issue comes in) having the best ability to 
properly place both the back end and the front end of the horse and 
apply aids to them separately is very important from a safety 
standpoint.  I don't want to just have to assume that the horse will 
take care of itself and never put a foot wrong, I want to be able to 
easily tell the horse where I want it to put its foot...if I have to.  
And there is no place where this is more important than out on the trail 
where the horse can easily be distracted, the footing is inconsistent, 
and the horse may be tired.

> Though I still won't ever believe that a rider needs to wear 
> spurs on an endurance ride.  I don't think they need whips either. 
> I feel that a horse should be able to complete a ride without having
> aids to 'push' them along, and that's what most people do that I've
> seen ride with whips and spurs.

And here is where you are showing your ignorance about the proper use of 
whips and spurs.  It may be what "most people" do that you have seen, 
but it isn't what _I_ do. I don't use spurs for 'pushing' my horses 
along, I use them for telling my horses how I want them to move their 
back legs and where I want them to put their back feet.  Some people may 
say that they can do this without spurs, but I'm saying that I bet they 
can't do it without spurs as well as I can do it with spurs.

>>  As it
>>was, I was able to quickly change her direction of motion, push
>>her hindleg underneath her and get her to her feet with the
>>single application of the spur on her right side.
>
>And she wouldn't give to your leg or heel without a spur?

No, she wouldn't have.  We are talking about a horse that had spooked at 
a car, bolted down a paved road, spun around when another car went by in 
the other direction, and whose feet had slipped out from underneath her.  
I will frankly admit that the mere application of my leg would not have 
gotten her attention, and if I had used my heel without the spur (even 
if that would have gotten her attention, which I doubt) I would have had 
to take my knee off her shoulder (yes, just for an instant) and I would 
have lost control of her shoulder and she may have slipped out again in 
front.  

I applied the spur in such a way as to get a REFLEX action from the 
horse (that is one of the things that spurs are very good for--just as 
it is easier for your doctor to get a reflex knee jerk from you with a 
hammer than it is if he just presses that spot with his finger).  Of 
course, if you over use the stimulus, you deaden the horse's reflexes.

Is it true that many riders would not have been able to do this even if 
they had been wearing spurs so see no value in them.  But I know how to 
do it, and I'll be damned if I will ride under a rule that says I am not 
allowed to use them for this purpose because they think I am too inept 
to do so.

I don't have any problem with riders choosing not to wear spurs because 
they don't believe that they have the control and expertise to use them, 
or because they are to ignorant to know that they DO have a valid and 
important use, or because they think that their horses are well trained 
enough to never benefit from their use.  Just don't force that choice on 
me because there are other people who abuse their horses.  Other people 
abuse their horses just by riding them; that doesn't mean that we should 
pass a rule saying that nobody is allowed to ride their horses.

Yes, spurs are hard to use correctly, but when used correctly they are, 
IMO, the most valuable aid that a rider has for keeping the horse 
exactly where he wants it on the course.  To take that away from riders 
because you assume that they are all just too inept is just plain dumb.  
And THAT is why "Spurs are prohibited" is a stupid rule.

kat
Orange County, Calif.

p.s.  To my knowledge, the AERC has no intention of passing such a rule, 
and I make these comments not by way of complaint about any AERC action 
but rather to educate people on the valuable and proper use of 
spurs...and just maybe they will actually take the time to learn how to 
use them and discover for themselves just how valuable of an aid they 
really are.